General DiscussionBest and most universal build for Jugg?

Phase Drum Yasha >whatever

Now if we're theory crafting... I wanna run orchid. =) Gives IAS + mana regen, + burst. Silence + R or Q = good damage.

phase fury

^Hes not really a farming hero, he doesnt really need fury . Hom is as good for farming and you get it online faster, and bank more off the level advantage.

Battlefury is trash on him imo, you don't get any advantage from the cleave unless your supports stack for you the entire jungle. With that said, he's pretty flexible, after his core items (phase, drums, yasha) you can get whatever you feel like.

I know that a lot of people rush agh on him but I don't think its reliable (same with bf). I feel like ring of aquila should be a core tbh because of that mana regen and with drums its basically enough for him to use his abilities without worrying too much about mana.

phase drums anything is standard. usual extensions are yasha/mael/deso/aghs/bfury and then later abyssal/butterfly/bkb/skadi/manta/satanic/crit/mkb

when in doubt, go phase drums yasha deso. amps ur ult, makes u much less kiteable, gives you carry

Compare stats from Ring of Aquila to Ring of basi, is spending 500 extra gold really worth the difference? Alot of times I find it's not... Just something to consider.

^soul ring

Hm, you might have a point Melody... so is my build at least ok for pub or is it really bad? lol. I really like jugg but sometimes it's just confusing when it comes to his item build :C + thx JDF.

dont pick jug trashcan hero

Well, i think drums is more than enough mana for him

ey boys, it all depends on the situation.

Do you have better lategame? Do your lineup fall of early?

-Phase/Treads>Aquila>Drums and try to end early is the way to go.

Are you confident going late vs enemy/your lineup?

-Phase/Threads>Midas (optional)>Battlefury>Yasha/Deso/Aghs/Manta/Mkb/Abbysal and so on. Also you might want to get a wand/bracer/drums but this is something u all already know

People saying battlefury/Aghs is trashtier you should look at the better jugger players, e.g. Guiri here on dotaboff

http://dotabuff.com/players/56593403/matches?date=&faction=&hero=juggernaut&lobby_type=&game_mode=&region=&duration=

wraith - phase - wand or aquila- drums - maelstrom

phase + drum is what I tend to go, everything else is situational

sometimes i get soul ring while laning, I prefer it over aquila/basilius. after phase + drum next item is in most cases, aghs or desolator.

sometimes it's a ring of protection start into basi, don't complete full aquila, since basi can go into vlads. a quick basi can also be used to push very early on.

after those items, if the game does get late, ill either get manta, basher/abyssal or bkb depending on what I'm against. sometimes diffusal vs ghost scepters

^maelstrom too stronk

everyone in this thread is ignoring it, but it is fucking awesome on jug. It accelerates his farm and the proc activates during his ulti and his blade fury.

Any one know how much attack speed he needs to get one attack off in each omnilash jump? I know it was 275 when his BAT was 1.5 but his BAT got buffed to 1.4. its not super relevant to the build, except that attack speed items stop boosting his ult after a point.

attack time = bat / (1 + ias)

0.4 = 1.4 / (1 + ias)

(1 + ias) = 1.4 / 0.4

1 + ias = 3.5

ias = 2.5

therefore you need 250 increased attack speed to attack once per omnislash

I was wondering. Does Jugg get Troll's ulti buff when he's omnislashing and Troll activates it?

aghanim refresher mjolnir desolator
inb4 flame

Midas as core for exp boost. Everything else but S&Y and bfury works on Jug.

I am a fan of midas too but if you say it in a forum they flame you :(

It wins games but you cant say it man, is bad on theory

Yes^ there was this very similar thread on dotobuff a bajillion years ago when Misery ?(not sure) started the midas craze with cm. Was discredited for midas and vlads over bfury if i recall.

i dont see what is wrong with S&Y on jugg

fury is good on juggernaut because HE CLEAVES IN OMNISLASH. deso is good on jugger since IT AMPLIFIES THE DAMAGE. Mjoll is good on jugger since IT LETS HIM ATTACK BETWEEN JUMPS.
and aghs is good for obvious reasons.
still this juggernaut is fully centered around his ultimate but can do pretty good without it too.

Concede i am the biggest S&Y fan, seriously i think i have like 70 % winrate with that item, but in my opinion manta is too good on juggernaut.

Illusions crit, they hit fast, they are really good at pushing and they remove silence so you can omnislash.

Right now my favorite build is phase midas ( situational ) drums aghs manta etc etc

Aghs is kind of like a Hand of Midas on jugger that farms heroes instead of creeps. Lowering that cooldown means that getting it is time sensitive.

I mean i dont really care about the extra slashes ( like someone posted here early game you are going to use omnislah in one person anyway so 6 or 9 slash doesnt really matter ) but the CD man.

Plus literally infinite mana, i think that with manta and aghs the enemy team cant really fight into you, if you are pushing a tower and they try to fight you. you are going to instakill 1 or 2 people, and you can do this every 70 seconds man.

Since sam told me that the biggest strenght of juggernaut is pushing towers i am trying to splitpush more with manta and ward

@dorkly

yea i dont get either recently. all about mjolner aghs satanic and bfly

I think that Desolator and AC are better pushing items than Manta for the most part.
Manta is most useful against negative buffs you can dispel, and spin works for most of those anyway.

Alright, you wanna play jugg? cmon man hes not in the pro scene for a reason. way too reliant on his ult for dps.

most builds end up capitalizing his ult, and ignoring any of his other skills except crits.

item builld:
starting items
tango, salve, stout shield, 2 branches or clarities depending on lane action

first items
aquila, phase boots, a wand as a maybe, yasha if you have the cash

core items initial
deso or skadi or mijoner. no battle fury, since jugg is not a farming position one, rather a mid-game action position 2.

finishing items later
manta, heart, butterfly, mijoner if not already possessing one or another orb if mijoner already is purchased. satanic also helps you, as well as AC or BKB if needed.

aghs is good if
1. you are not the only carry. in that case you may grab a bf.
2. you are killing a lot
3. you already have an orb

Fury is bad. If omnislash was like sleight of fist with a controlled aoe for cleave then yes bfury cleave is reasonable. Why would you depend on cleave if you cant even control the omnislash "bounces" let alone the direction of the attacks whilst in omnislash for cleave to be remotely useful.

Given that you can cast spells whilst in omnislash it should theoretically be possible to control the slashes by
1. Spamming A/M/H keys on certain target or using certain item triggers such as abyssal blade
2. Casting dagger/fs which could be used to cancel omnislash prematurely or re-position.

Its all rainbow pulled out from my ass though, i could be very wrong.

S&Y wouldn't work imo simply because Sange is a marginally useful component when you cant really *chase* down heroes as juggernaut.
Manta is at best sketchy and situational build-up from yasha for disjointing/dispelling certain projectiles/silences and tower siege.

I would definitely take necrobook 3 over manta if not for the armor, bounty gold nerf on the necro units

What items would you need to get to 250 IAS by say level 16? If he starts with 20 agi and gains 2.85 a level, then at 16 he has 65 and still needs 185 IAS? That's still a ton, you'd need like mjollnir, ac and manta and still be a couple short I think. Even at 25 he needs like 160 so you still need mnollnir, ac or butterfly and another IAS item.

Is there another amount to attack during omnilash but not during every hit?