General DiscussionCan anybody help to analyze my 4K MMR Luna game?

Rofl aghs

why didnt u go traditional luna build and just farm more in general?

also why didnt you build refresher with aghs?

hmmm ok.. why the Agh's Scepter?

First of all, I think it is a pretty strong mid game item - it actually enabled me to get that ultra kill and some more clashes while maintaining a good position against a Blink Call Axe. There were also the softies in Crystal Maiden and Wind-ranger.

What went wrong is the item progression after that - after Manta, I never had the space to farm BKB nor Hurricane Pike as I have to be very careful with enemy Invoker who was literally hunting me across the map.

In a typical Luna game, after creating so much space. I wouldn't have a hard time rotating throughout the jungle to get the necessary late game items. But I really thought that that Invoker reallly carried them big time.

But then again, these could be just excuses to my poor play.

Can anyone watch and check out this game?

wake up u had 16 min treads domi stick aquila what great early game u talking about

and u dont even have any1 to cast aghs ulti on

intstead of worthless aghs manta u couldve went pike bkb diffusal and the game wouldve been an easy win as long as u dont get called

The problem is that half your post is superfluous information when you could've just posted a link to the match instead.

Hmmm intersting.. emotionally, I felt I had a great laning phase as I was able to kill WR multiple times.

But objectively, this was the item progression: (Can comment please, how fast I should be able to buy things)
- 01:54: Basilius
- 04:41: Headress
- 06:17: Aquila
- 11:14: Raindrops
- 12:22: Domi
- 16:39: Treads
- 18:19: Dragon Lance
- 26:11: Agh's Scepter
- 35:45: Manta

so what was your plan. indeed an aghs eclipse can be strong mid game. then what?

@Potato Marshal edited the link above. I thought I posted the match link (found out it was my profile link) sorry for that

@Jacked then progress to Manta + BKB + Hurricane Pike + MKB perhaps if game is still not ended

u need to get items as fast as u can but 16 min treads domi aquila is terrible and usually u get these timings when either there are 999 heroes in ur lane(doesnt rly matter if u die or not, u still lose tons of farm) or u just get trashed early game and theres nowhere to farm

the problem with that progression is you are going for items that should make u strong in the midgame, but ur getting it late (and thus u missed ur timing). just skip manta go eblade refresher. lul

^ So 18 minutes for Treads + Wand + Aquila + Dominator + Dragon Lance is bad timing?

What's the ideal timing for those items?

i mean when u go aghs and u get 30+ min manta with no bkb no pike

i dont know and i dont care, go launch a 1v0 lobby and feed some bots down ur lane if u are curious

You definitely needed to farm faster and push harder. You should at least have either a hurricane pike or manta by 20 minutes. I don't know what the timing on the enemy towers were, but 1.2k damage is way too low for Luna, especially considering you maxed glaives that early. You should definitely not have gotten aghs, especially with an SD on your team.

ideal timings dont mean shit there are games where u get super farmed because u have freefarm/ppl feed ur lane and then there are games where u get camped by 3 heroes and they ward ur jungle and control the entire map and u cant get good timings even if u have perfect farming patterns

^timings are an indication of how well you play that game. it tells you how to play optimally on a hero. getting a late timing is only partly a result of the game condition. but usually it is something you can control by not fucking up. for example, put rtz in OPs 4k game and camp him mid or whatever excuse you have, and find me a game where he doesnt just get good item timings and end games easily all day.

CUT THE BULLSHIT , everyone. this mentality from some players that you can do always something better to win the game is so triggering rly. yes you can always do something better, even miracle can no one play perfect dota, but that doesnt mean will lead you in win. you did your part good enough , you played much better than their carry , but thats all your max impact to win a game is 20% the rest is up to team , and its crystal clear that sf was rly low compared to invoker, thats 1 factor and its enough to stop you wining that game.

no shit if ure 5k higher than the bracket ure playing in ure gonna get great timings because ur decision making and mechanics are on an entirely different level

how does that help op or anyone rly

yes you can always do something better

yes. yes you can. and miracle would play close to perfect dota in every single one of your 3k games. that means his impact would be 100%. yes. it means it is hardly up to his team. otherwise youd see high mmr player only getting maximum of 80% winrate in low mmr games. did you pull that number out of your ass or what? how is it that you use false numbers as pseudo evidence to justify your bullshit proposition and think you are smart?

it's simple math. if you can figure out a way to play a hero optimally, so that 9/10 games u hit earlier item timings, you have a clear advantage over your enemies 9/10 games. then you account for shit out of your control because you are not miracle. such as bad teammates, whatever excuse you have. and you'd win 6/10 games and profit. or you keep your shitty attitude and only get an item advantage 5/10 games ebcause it is your right as lousy player to not get good item timings. then you win 5/10 of your games and cry about it.

im struggling to see your point really

https://www.dotabuff.com/players/119544965/matches?hero=luna

Obviously there are some games you do much worse or much better depending on the situations but you can clearly see patterns develop. Like how OP almost always rushing wand, getting late treads, rushing aghs, and delaying manta/bkb/hurricane in favor of aghs.

^ of course a poster with at least half a brain and makes a lot of sense. and he is 4k+ and i'd seriously doubt those 2 monkeys will hit 4k any time soon. lol

miralce can play my ass close to perfect dota. go watch him in kiev major eating shit. even summail that is like 2k mmr below him is doing much much more better than him. so yeah mmr its not jsut a number its something but not everything . its a moving number. its a fucking team game, and even miracle if team up with this jackshited, would loose everygame . cause you looks so dumb you cant play this game is strategy team game need brain.

you are right. except we are talking about 4k games here and not the highest level of dota where there is hardly any room for suboptimal plays.

you have to accept that in 4k there's a lot of room to improve a wide range of things. item timings is just one of them and there's no excuse to even talk about your team at this level when there are players who can easily 1 v 5 in that bracket.

It's honestly not very hard to identify mistakes from 4k players. For example, we often usually have very static builds for each hero and are reluctant to adapt our item and skill builds to the situation at hand, myself included. We tend to have our builds work well in one match, then replicate it in another hoping for the same results despite a completely different enemy and ally composition.

^ asked @Zenoth about item timings and i think I know what I'm doing wrong.

Because, personally I think I was able to hit 80% of the LH during those 1st 10 minutes and still I got my Treads + Aquila + Dominator by 16 minutes.

But the thing is, I creep control too much. I told him that the only way to reach those items @10 minute mark is to push and stack + some Tier 1 towers for good measure.

Thank you for this and it kind of puts things in perspective.

But other than item timings, i still finished 13-5... can anyone comment on the gameplay itself?

^not sure if it is still worth to go dom on luna. feels like a shitty item. i wouldnt even focus so much on the early game item timings of aquila dom treads. i think what most ppl would think looking at ur game is the more major item timings. which is manta at 30+ mins which seems really critical mistake/ and all the other necessary big mid game items like bkb pike, which never came as a result.

the other striking thing is the level of farm for a hero that can farm really well. so there's still a lot of room to improve from an efficiency standpoint. for gameplay itself, well its hard to comment as you're probably better at gameplay than i am, and i didnt watch your game.

ur item build after dlance is shit and i dont know how 1-9 sf has same gpm as 13-5 luna im really baffled by how ur gpm is not atleast 600

Just stop rushing aghs and you'll play a lot better in your Luna games.

lol.. you brain washed dick heads, rly make me lagh so hard with your theories from higher mmr players which you treat them like gods. i dont see how that luna with better timing itemizatoin would win a game vs 7 slots invoker cause he was fedded by that game loser sf. yeah god luck on your item timing improving and notice me when you win a game , with that unbalanced mid lane like this one.

theories

lol. what was that phrase JD used again? willful ignorance. um. i mean if you are too stupid to understand the logic behind it, whatever man. just enjoy your 3k games

wtf why did i even try to waste my time reasoning with a 40% winrate normal skill shitstain. of course you're gonna be a delusional team blaming dickhead

lol. holy shit im rly enjoying this topic so much, yeah it is to hard to understand the logic behind it obviosly from your part. so you think the game is depended on your performance, no matter how your team perform . ok to make it simple for your below 80 hq people here. i make an example for you, an ez one. if you were talking to that sf and not with that luna guy, you whould say to him well you clearly lost that game cause you fucked up so hard feeding that invoker and manage to catch up and help team a littlbe bit and your entire team got stomped by that invoker so your bad performance leaded in your loss . but your talking to that luna and your small brain cant see the entire big view and foccus only in her game, which could be better but never determinant for game result , gues what , cause of your theory that 1 simple person can win the game or loose it , than even that sf is 1 single person that deserved to loose that game, so how can luna win a game which is lsot by an sf which is in your team. ok sry i dindt explain that simple for your small brain lol

lol , this is the reason why you will remain dumb you cant see the big view, am not a porfessional dota player i play dota for fun mostly with my friends in party recently i got some completely new friends in dota gave them acc with around 3 k , and yeah lsot mostly of games cause their not even 1 mmr they completely new. but wait you can solo win games do you want to party once with them and try it ? lol

^if i was luna i would have won

if op didnt go for a braindead build hed probably win the game their pa was a non-factor and every other hero is not a rpbolem with bkb pike diffusal

LOSE, MMR down to 4049
https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/3139362265
Match Id: 3139362265
Luna Safe Lane Carry
K-D-A: 13-5-10
GPM: 441
XPM: 557
Dmg: 27.3k
Had a great early and mid game. Rotated, map-aware, playing with the team etc
But this is one of those games where we got rekt easily by a very fat Invoker
our mid Shadow Fiend finished 1-9-7 while enemy Invoker was 17-3-11
Personally though I found couple of big mistakes on my part:
1. More effective use of Aghs Scepter Luna - that one clash where they were on the retreat - it felt that I could have gotten more kills.
2. End game where they were sieging our base, i should have bought that force staff instead of waiting on my BKB; facing an Invoker, I felt dead mead with 0 mobility inspite of a Shadow Demon and Earth Spirit behind
3. I also had a mistake while trying to push Mid tower after getting an ULTRA KILL; we overextended as I felt cocky and wasn't focused enough. That kind of turned things around for them.
If there's anyone there with free time. Help to analyze this game please.

Check my recent Luna games (Not the latest ones , I had bad games there)

But before that they were good. Always 700+ gpm and XPM

cause of your theory that 1 simple person can win the game or loose it , than even that sf is 1 single person that deserved to loose that game, so how can luna win a game which is lsot by an sf which is in your team. ok sry i dindt explain that simple for your small brain lol

lmao.

and yeah lsot mostly of games cause their not even 1 mmr they completely new. but wait you can solo win games do you want to party once with them and try it ?

rofl. i see how you think. there's no arguing with you. you are stuck in a complete fallacy and you don'teven realise it. please stop talking like the shit you say makes complete sense. rofl you have no idea how retarded you sound

"Arguing with an idiot is like playing chess with a pidgeon. It'll just knock over all the pieces, shit on the board, and strut about like it's won anyway."

i mean, i can see how your argument makes complete sense to you on a very elementary level. but what i don't get is how youre the one claiming im not seeing the big picture.

everybodys playing checkers but ive been playing chess for years

4800 dota games
3k
feelsbadman

1350 solo mmr jackshited, talking to me about theories and how good he plays dota with his 64 % wirate which is mostly party wins cause of his 3500 party mmr. this shit its getting better and better ahahhahahahahhahahahahhahahahhahahhahahahahahhahahahh

u lost this game bcz :

1- u pick luna againts invo
2- ur gpm is 400
3- u build agha and no bkb againts invo
4-u build hotd in 7.05 while this item is dead
5- dont pick carry if u wanna win or u will be in 3k soon

mafioso, i love observing your delusion so much, i might even make an idiot's guide to explain why it is not your team's fault you are dog shit. lul

oh. and stop throwing words you don't understand around loosely. they won't make your shallow arguments sound any better. facts are not theories. lol. maybe once your brain develops you can form actual arguments with real evidence and we can have a real discussion. right now youre just spewing flawed logic. when i have the time i'll write you an idiot's guide to show you how much you mean to me <3